69 Mach 1 SCJ Vakue
#1
Hi All,

I’m looking at purchasing a 69 Mach 1 428 SCJ with the Drag Pak Option. It has the 3.91 Trac Lock, external oil cooler and C6 Tranny. It’s in great shape. My question is - the eng is a period correct 428 not the numbers matching one, all rebuilt with correct crank,rods heads and intake and carb and it has headers and a MSD dizzy and coil. However the fella didn’t keep the exh manifolds, original dizzy and coil. Is the value still there?Are these reasons not to purchase the car because it’s not all original? It is a gorgeous car though and pretty rare? I’d love to buy it. What do you you guys think? Thanks!
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#2
Value is in the eye of the beholder - I imagine.

If you are mostly interested in re-sale value then all of those discrepancies come into their own.  Other than matching number engine the other components can be put back. 

Or .. do you want to own it (or one like it) because it has always been a dream and it is exactly or close to that ideal car?  If that is the case then a reasonable price is a good price and a good purchase.

Then comes the consideration of what will you do with it once you have it.  Will you be comfortable using it for what you have in mind or will the expense and it's risk overshadow any enjoyment you may possible ever get?

Keep us posted as to your decision as well as to your decision process.  How you come to your conclusion may help the next guy reach his.  :)
[Image: Arizona_flag_32w.gif]
Southern Arizona
Current Mustangs:
1973 Mach 1

1971 Mustang Grande
1965 Mustang
[Image: stevenharris.jpg]
http://www.mexicomissionariesofcbt.blogspot.com/
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#3
If you want a "Priceless Artifact". Pass on it. If you want to drive it, and enjoy it. Buy it! Then drive it like you stole it!

Just my thoughts. 

JTS
"We built these cars to drive the "HELL" out of them, not to be museum pieces!"  Carroll Shelby

2008 Mustang V6 5 speed "Diablo Sport Predator" tuner, 87 octane tune. WOW!
1994 Ford F150 Shortbed
1986 Honda 450 Rebel
1995 Honda Pacific Coast
1989 Jacobra / Jag xjs
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#4
That is a rare car.  Is it truly what you describe?  Does it have a Marti Report to verify everything?  If so, if it was correctly restored and not merely patched, without the numbers matching motor, it's probably a $55K to $60K car in my opinion.  I kind of base that on a restored numbers matching 428 CJ 1969 Mach 1 (not a drag pack car) selling for $54K at a local classic car dealer about 2 years ago.

But on the downside, you cannot drive it much without effecting the value.  Every mile will reduce the value of it.  And parts specific to that model car will be hard to find and extremely expensive.

Hagerty insurance has a valuation utility you can try to get another idea of its value.  Hagerty values are higher than what I was thinking.  But I don't follow car values as much as Hagerty.  https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationto...?id=123510
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#5
It is funny how the drivetrains in these rare cars seem to go missing. Do you know what happened to the original motor?  I can appreciate the seller disclosing the fact that the motor is not original but I believe the motor and the drivetrain in these cars are the real value drivers.  If the motor was replaced with another Cobrajet block that would be a plus but unfortunately the only way to really confirm this by dropping the transmission and looking for a large C welded to back of the motor.  Otherwise you may be paying a premium for a hopped up 390 motor with 428 rods.  Maybe this can be a negotiating point for you.

The automatic transmission is also a value dropper.  I believe the 4 speed SCJ cars bring up the value. Check the Hagerty site like 1969_Mach1 suggested.

Good luck with your decision and let us know how you make out.

Mike
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#6
The drivetrains go missing in cars like this primarily because they were beat to death in the early years of their life.  I guess it was never expected that these cars would be desirable 50 years or so later.  So people just beat the heck out of them, then threw them away.

I've noticed in general with cars of this age, it is the plane basic models with 6 cylinder or small basic 2-barrel V8's that are in the most original and best conditions.  Anything that was worth street or track racing was beat on until broken beyond simple repairs.  Then parked and left to rot into the earth or hauled to a wrecking yard.  So to me it's no surprise it doesn't have the original motor.  It's more surprising the car still exists.
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#7
(08-30-2018, 02:26 AM)1969_Mach1 Wrote: The drivetrains go missing in cars like this primarily because they were beat to death in the early years of their life.  I guess it was never expected that these cars would be desirable 50 years or so later.  So people just beat the heck out of them, then threw them away.

I've noticed in general with cars of this age, it is the plane basic models with 6 cylinder or small basic 2-barrel V8's that are in the most original and best conditions.  Anything that was worth street or track racing was beat on until broken beyond simple repairs.  Then parked and left to rot into the earth or hauled to a wrecking yard.  So to me it's no surprise it doesn't have the original motor.  It's more surprising the car still exists.
One man's junk is another man's gold.  If you owned or worked in a scrap yard back in the 70's and early 80's and had some foresight you could be a rich man. 

I tend to think it's the 4 door cars that seem to be in the most original and best condition.  Maybe the people who bought the 4 door cars were relatively more mature and responsible.
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#8
You are probably right.  Sadly on the west coast scrap yards are very few.  Most are now called "Dismantlers".  Basically large parts that are desirable and of any value are removed to be sold.  Then the rest of the car is scrapped.  For many models the entire car or truck is simply scrapped.  Some of it is merely economics and some of it is some looney west coast environmental regulations.  As you can guess I don't quite fit the mold of those living here.
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#9
Well I currently own a beauty of a 69 Mach 1 all numbers matching with a built 351w. I’ve owned it 25yrs. The only thing that is non matching is the custom built T5 Conversion I did and got rid of the FMX boat anchor. The car is so much fun to drive now. I am now considering and negotiating on this other mint 69 Mach 428 SCJ w C6 and 97000 Miles.Although it’s not the original eng, exh manifolds or dizzy and coil I still think there’s good value and collectibility in the car. But I would have to sell mine in order to do the deal.My car is bought and paid for and for the most part it’s all done ( though are they really?) and of course I’m going to have to shell out a qite few bucks for sure to close the deal. So Im trying to get opinions from you guys / gals to help me make a good and right decision. Thnx!
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#10
"The car is so much fun to drive now."

I believe that the above quote taken from your response sheds a lot of light on your decision.

And ... without a doubt the 69 428 SCJ will fit that bill as well but I go back to my original thought:  due to it's rarity and a desire to increase it's value will you be willing to drive it or find that it more than not stays parked so that nothing happens to your investment.

Tough call - too bad having both is not an option.
[Image: Arizona_flag_32w.gif]
Southern Arizona
Current Mustangs:
1973 Mach 1

1971 Mustang Grande
1965 Mustang
[Image: stevenharris.jpg]
http://www.mexicomissionariesofcbt.blogspot.com/
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