351c wont start, help
#31
I am waiting for my wife to get ready to go out so I logged back in.  Interesting I missed the 25 minutes as well.  I had a friend who had overtightened the valves on his car and all the car did was crank no start.  I buddy of mine picked right up on this, readjusted the valves on the spot and the car fired right up.  Out of curiosity are you following the Ford manuals for the sequence of adjusting your valves and the manufacture's recommendation for adjusting them?
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#32
(11-25-2018, 08:06 AM)Mustangmike Wrote: I am waiting for my wife to get ready to go out so I logged back in.  Interesting I missed the 25 minutes as well.  I had a friend who had overtightened the valves on his car and all the car did was crank no start.  I buddy of mine picked right up on this, readjusted the valves on the spot and the car fired right up.  Out of curiosity are you following the Ford manuals for the sequence of adjusting your valves and the manufacture's recommendation for adjusting them?

That's kind of why I asked him if it has a nice even rhythm when cranking.  Odd cranking rhythm is a clear indicator of something wrong, valves out of adjustment like you mentioned, one or more cylinders with low compression, etc.
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#33
(11-25-2018, 11:48 AM)1969_Mach1 Wrote:
(11-25-2018, 08:06 AM)Mustangmike Wrote: I am waiting for my wife to get ready to go out so I logged back in.  Interesting I missed the 25 minutes as well.  I had a friend who had overtightened the valves on his car and all the car did was crank no start.  I buddy of mine picked right up on this, readjusted the valves on the spot and the car fired right up.  Out of curiosity are you following the Ford manuals for the sequence of adjusting your valves and the manufacture's recommendation for adjusting them?

That's kind of why I asked him if it has a nice even rhythm when cranking.  Odd cranking rhythm is a clear indicator of something wrong, valves out of adjustment like you mentioned, one or more cylinders with low compression, etc.
Here is a quote from another site.  Sounds a little familiar:

No Start/Compression after adjusting valves after cam break-in

Hey guys, I have an interesting problem that I can not figure out. I just completed a head & camshaft swap in my El Camino. The engine is a 350. I finished it up on Saturday and I pushed the car into the driveway to break in the camshaft. I initially couldn’t get the car running so I hooked up a timing light and the mark was way off the timing tab so I brought number one cylinder to TDC and removed and reinstalled the distributor one tooth towards the passenger side of the car. I used the finger method to determine that I was at TDC. I initially dropped the distributor with the timing marks on the new timing set lined up, but it didn’t seem to hit exactly at number one so I figured we’ll see if she starts. It didn’t start so that it when I moved it one tooth over.

Okay, after I moved the distributor, the timing light confirmed that I was in the ballpark so I fired the car up and proceeded to break in the engine. The car wouldn’t idle but it ran very well between 2000-3500RPM so I ran it there for 20 or so minutes to break in the camshaft. I played with the timing a bit and got the car to move back and forth so I backed it into the garage and shut her off.

Next I readjusted the valves using the method where you adjust half with number one up and half with number six up. I then buttoned everything back up and went to start the car, it wouldn’t start. I hooked up a timing light which confirms that I am at least in the ball park with the distributor, but it won’t start. So I pull number 1 plug and figure that perhaps the dizzy is in wrong still so I put my finger over the hole and have my father in law crank the engine, the engine does not blow my finger off so I hook up a compression tester, the compression tester confirms I have no compression (ZERO) in cylinders number 1 and 3. (I didn’t test the rest, I expect similar results).

What is my problem guys? Why don’t I have compression? Why did this engine start and run so well during break in only to not run and have no compression after merely adjusting the valves?
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#34
Sometimes when you readjust hydraulic lifters, because they are now filled with oil, instead of the plunger moving down in the lifter body when you tighten the adjuster, it pops the valve open.  You simply have to wait.  The lifter will eventually bleed down and the valve will close.  This happens at high RPM with some hydraulic lifters as well.  They pump up, hold the valves open and the engine dies.  Some people like to pump up new lifters when installing them.  Then when you adjust the valves, they hang open and the motor won't start or runs very rough for a while.
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#35
I was following the ford shop manual in the engine book for valve adjustment, so that is wrong I guess and I should go with the comp cam adjustment method?
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#36
The 750 does not have a choke on it that's one reason I bought a new 650 that did.i am using the valvoline racing oil that is made for push rod engines, it says it high in zinc, I was planning on running that for the life of the engine just for peace of mind
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#37
(11-25-2018, 02:01 PM)My70mach1 Wrote: I was following the ford shop manual in the engine book for valve adjustment, so that is wrong I guess and I should go with the comp cam adjustment method?

I'm not familiar with what's in the Ford shop manual.  How far past zero lash is suggested in the Ford shop manual?  Since you have Comp's lifters I would follow their method so you know the lifters are preloaded correctly.  There are more than one method to be certain the lifter for the valve being adjusted is on the base of the lobe.  The method in Comp Cams instructions will work every time.

Valvoline Racing oil is a good choice.  I like it.  But I like 10W-40 and it's not available in Valvoline Racing oil.  For now I am using Lucus Hot Rod and Classic Car oil.  So far happy with it.  Plus it's made for cars that are rarely driven which is good.  It clings to surfaces to prevent dry starts.  It actually does, the oil film doesn't wipe off of surfaces nearly as easy as other oils.
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#38
(11-25-2018, 02:41 PM)1969_Mach1 Wrote:
(11-25-2018, 02:01 PM)My70mach1 Wrote: I was following the ford shop manual in the engine book for valve adjustment, so that is wrong I guess and I should go with the comp cam adjustment method?

I'm not familiar with what's in the Ford shop manual.  How far past zero lash is suggested in the Ford shop manual?  Since you have Comp's lifters I would follow their method so you know the lifters are preloaded correctly.  There are more than one method to be certain the lifter for the valve being adjusted is on the base of the lobe.  The method in Comp Cams instructions will work every time.

Valvoline Racing oil is a good choice.  I like it.  But I like 10W-40 and it's not available in Valvoline Racing oil.  For now I am using Lucus Hot Rod and Classic Car oil.  So far happy with it.  Plus it's made for cars that are rarely driven which is good.  It clings to surfaces to prevent dry starts.  It actually does, the oil film doesn't wipe off of surfaces nearly as easy as other oils.

I know there is a sequence to follow for adjusting the valves.  I am not sure if it was in the shop manual or my small block ford rebuild book.  I followed it when I set my valves. I remember marking my harmonic balancer and turning the motor 90 degrees and worked my way around valves following the order in the book/manual.   I am sure there is more than one way to do it but the accountant needs guidance (LOL)!
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#39
(11-25-2018, 10:01 PM)Mustangmike Wrote:
(11-25-2018, 02:41 PM)1969_Mach1 Wrote:
(11-25-2018, 02:01 PM)My70mach1 Wrote: I was following the ford shop manual in the engine book for valve adjustment, so that is wrong I guess and I should go with the comp cam adjustment method?

I'm not familiar with what's in the Ford shop manual.  How far past zero lash is suggested in the Ford shop manual?  Since you have Comp's lifters I would follow their method so you know the lifters are preloaded correctly.  There are more than one method to be certain the lifter for the valve being adjusted is on the base of the lobe.  The method in Comp Cams instructions will work every time.

Valvoline Racing oil is a good choice.  I like it.  But I like 10W-40 and it's not available in Valvoline Racing oil.  For now I am using Lucus Hot Rod and Classic Car oil.  So far happy with it.  Plus it's made for cars that are rarely driven which is good.  It clings to surfaces to prevent dry starts.  It actually does, the oil film doesn't wipe off of surfaces nearly as easy as other oils.

I know there is a sequence to follow for adjusting the valves.  I am not sure if it was in the shop manual or my small block ford rebuild book.  I followed it when I set my valves. I remember marking my harmonic balancer and turning the motor 90 degrees and worked my way around valves following the order in the book/manual.   I am sure there is more than one way to do it but the accountant needs guidance (LOL)!

I think I know the sequence you are referring to.  I used it when I had a solid lifter cam to try to get the valves adjusted faster while the engine was hot.  At each crank position there are certain intake and exhaust valves to adjust.  All in all, you only had to rotate the crank three times.  But at least for me, it was easy to loose track of what valves you had adjusted.  The Comp Cams, and for that matter every major cam mfg.'s method, is less confusing but takes much longer.
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#40
(11-26-2018, 03:47 AM)1969_Mach1 Wrote:
(11-25-2018, 10:01 PM)Mustangmike Wrote:
(11-25-2018, 02:41 PM)1969_Mach1 Wrote:
(11-25-2018, 02:01 PM)My70mach1 Wrote: I was following the ford shop manual in the engine book for valve adjustment, so that is wrong I guess and I should go with the comp cam adjustment method?

I'm not familiar with what's in the Ford shop manual.  How far past zero lash is suggested in the Ford shop manual?  Since you have Comp's lifters I would follow their method so you know the lifters are preloaded correctly.  There are more than one method to be certain the lifter for the valve being adjusted is on the base of the lobe.  The method in Comp Cams instructions will work every time.

Valvoline Racing oil is a good choice.  I like it.  But I like 10W-40 and it's not available in Valvoline Racing oil.  For now I am using Lucus Hot Rod and Classic Car oil.  So far happy with it.  Plus it's made for cars that are rarely driven which is good.  It clings to surfaces to prevent dry starts.  It actually does, the oil film doesn't wipe off of surfaces nearly as easy as other oils.

I know there is a sequence to follow for adjusting the valves.  I am not sure if it was in the shop manual or my small block ford rebuild book.  I followed it when I set my valves. I remember marking my harmonic balancer and turning the motor 90 degrees and worked my way around valves following the order in the book/manual.   I am sure there is more than one way to do it but the accountant needs guidance (LOL)!

I think I know the sequence you are referring to.  I used it when I had a solid lifter cam to try to get the valves adjusted faster while the engine was hot.  At each crank position there are certain intake and exhaust valves to adjust.  All in all, you only had to rotate the crank three times.  But at least for me, it was easy to loose track of what valves you had adjusted.  The Comp Cams, and for that matter every major cam mfg.'s method, is less confusing but takes much longer.

You are correct.  My car is a solid lifter cam and I remember there being a sequence I followed.  I will probably be re-doing mine again in the Spring.
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