Headers for 1969 mach 1 351w 4brrl?
#1
I am looking to buy Hooker Headers 6116-1HKR: Hooker Super Competition Headers for 69 mach 1 with 351w 4brrl, auto fmx trans, and 600cfm edelbrock carb. Does anyone know how these headers fit? also how much horsepower can i gain from them?
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#2
Not certain about fitment. Although the Super Comp series have a reputation for being more application specific and work in hard to fit situations. Their only drawback is they are made from thinner wall tubing and have thinner flanges than all other high end headers, such as JBA, etc. Chances of gasket leaks at the cylinder head and exhaust pipe flanges are more likely. Those are not easy to stop because thinner flanges bend and warp too easily. I believe the Hedman Elite series are made with thicker tubing and have thicker flanges. But again, not certain of fitment.

Look for a header with a minimum 3/8" thick steel or 5/16" thick stainless steel flange that attaches to the head. Also, ball socket connections to the exhaust pipe work much better than the traditional 3 or 4 bolt flange at the exhaust pipe.

Basically, get the best you can afford. Inexpensive headers, or headers made with thin materials, always cause problems.

I use the JBA's mid length headers (others call them shorties) but these are longer than shorties. They fit without any issues. The only thing I did was buy ARP's reduced hex size header bolts so a socket or box end wrench fits on every bolt.

Best Regards,
Mike

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#3
I swore off Hooker headers after a terrible experience with them. I ordered a set of Hooker Super Comp headers for my wife's Buick GS. I ordered the ceramic powder-coated version, which was very expensive. They rusted within 3 months of installing them on the car and leaked badly. This is on a garage-kept car that doesn't see rain. The leak was due to the "powder coating", which had dripped and built up on one side of the flanges, preventing a seal with the exhaust manifold. I asked around by calling different powder coating companies and was told that Hooker won't pay any powder coating company even enough to cover their costs. I would bet that my "ceramic powder coat" headers were simply spray painted silver.
Hooker sent me a new set, which I requested non-coated, but only after repeatedly calling and complaining. I took them to a powder-coat shop and had them ceramic powdered coated professionally at my expense - their original powder coating sucks and the quality control on the flange decking is non-existent, as I had to have a machine shop grind the flange on one of the non-coated headers flat before powder coating. I still have the original set hanging in my basement, reminding me never to deal with Hooker again.

The headers I have on my 1969 351W with a 4brrl are Hedman. I've had no problems whatsoever and love the sound. You can hear them here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIyyKHhqbac
(In the spirit of transparency, I had the 351W stroked to a 410 last year, and have a Magnaflow exhaust, which I'm sure adds some of the sound you hear)

Here's how they look, at least from the top: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ajcu9ovfuo0ok6...3.jpg?dl=0

If you're set on Hooker headers, I strongly recommend getting them bare and having them powder coating by a professional company like Jet Hot. Be sure to check the flange is flat enough to provide a good seal to the manifold.
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#4
I've installed several sets of headers - Hooker, Hedman, and Doug Thorley. All (to some extent) had welding slag and/or grinding marks on the tube and flange where it bolts to the head. You can't expect to have a leak free installation without first fully inspecting and prepping the mating surface with a flat machinist file. If you don't, you're asking for trouble. You probably got lucky with the Hedmans. Hooker Super Comps are known for their exact application fit. They're pricey because of tooling costs - (several applications for one car/engine combo based on auto trans. vs manual, manual steering vs power steering, A/C or non A/C). Just what I've listed alone yields maybe 6-10 different part numbers for one car. I bought a set of Hookers for my '64 Galaxie with a 390' C-6. There were 4 different part numbers based on other stuff like power brakes?, power steering? 3 speed, 4 speed, or automatic trans.? When I received the headers and opened the box, it looked like a Chinese puzzle that I had to put together. Some of the tubes had to be put in after the header flanges were already bolted to the heads. I even had to clearance the driver's side wheel well. Hooker Super Comps yield more power increases because they strive to keep all the tubes the same length - not so with a lot of other brands. It took me a day and a half to install them - AFTER I prepped the mating surfaces and test fit the tubes to each other. It doesn't pay to buy the cheapest header gaskets either. I purchased a pair of Mr. Gasket extra thick gaskets, a must for any installation. I had no leaks ever and I sold the car 10 years later - still, no leaks. Granted, the car was not a daily driver and was stored in a heated garage. Back in 1989 the headers cost me $649.00 - with no coating. I painted them with VHT, the best header paint available, 8 cans of it. Four coats of paint allowed to dry thoroughly between coats. It took almost a week just for the paint to dry, but I never had a rust issue. Patience is a virtue, and the result was worth the extra time, expense, and effort. A lot of guys think they're just going to "slap on a set of headers". I got news for them. They're going to get frustrated installing them and disappointed with the results if they don't do their homework. GXR
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#5
My only experience with Hooker headers was when I was younger. A friend of mine had Hooker Competition headers on a 1972 Nova. They fit fine. But we couldn't stop exhaust leaks at the cylinder heads. About every 6 weeks the leaks would get bad enough and we would replace the gaskets. Back then we thought all headers had leaking issues. So, replacing gaskets didn't end until he sold the car.

On my 69 Mach 1 I have JBA headers. I have never had an issue with them. On my daily driver F150, the headers I installed were from Ford Racing. The flanges at the cylinder heads were machined by the mfg. After 40K miles, I have never had to replace a gasket. For both my Mach 1 and my F150 I have the Mr. Gasket lock washers on the header bolts. I periodically check the bolts, but they don't come loose.

Best Regards,
Mike
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#6
I have the 6116 supercomps on my 69, fit well and have had zero issues with them.

69 Mach1, 351w 4v, FMX, A/C, P/S, P/B.
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#7
@ rsmach1

since your mach has the same setup as mine (minus the ac), were there any issues fitting these in? I plan to do this myself

Also did you feel the difference when driving? how much hp do you think you gained?

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#8
It's been years since I installed them, if I remember correctly I was able to install them without jacking up the motor, 1 went in from the top, and the other from under the car. Don't use aftermarket gaskets when bolting them up, use the "stock type" Felpro exhaust gaskets that have the silver "foil" on one side, and make sure the foil faces out towards the header. If you have had any port work done to the heads you may have to trim the opening of the gasket to match (What heads are you running?) . Also, I highly recommend getting some some Stage 8 header bolts, as they will keep from loosening. As far as HP that will depend on a lot of variables, generally speaking you can expect 15 to 20 HP or so with a good set of headers. What have you done to the engine? Stock, modified?
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#9
The engine is 351w 4brrl stock. I have a mild cam, edelbrock 600cfm. thats about it.
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#10
Cool, you should feel difference with the headers, will sound better, and it will make the engine more efficient. Also if you are putting a new dual exhaust don't go any bigger than 2 1/2 diameter. Don't forget to order the power steering drop bracket for the ram, or the headers won't clear the p/s ram. Randy.
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