altenator question

[Steven Harris]

Thanks Mike and GXR for picking up the thread challenge and running with it. As all the information has added up it does sound as though the culprit will be the starter.

The new style permanent magnet gear reduction style starter will definitely make a "believer" of you.

Let us know the final outcome.

[1969_Mach1]

Steve, thanks for the vote of confidence, ...... I think .

I do see OEM style hi torque starters on Summit Racing's website. But they are still large like the OEM so heat may still be a concern because of close proximity to the exhaust. Trying one would be the only way to know. Before settling on an aftermarket starter I would do some research and see if an OEM starter for a late model truck (about 1995 or newer) will fit. Maybe for a truck with a 460? When I bought mine, the parts person at my local Ford dealer looked it up for a 1969 Mustang, it changed part numbers several times, then he handed me the new style starter that also fits mid 1990's trucks. It came with an additional length of 10 ga. wire, a couple if wire tires, and instructions on how to reconnect the wiring.

I've had great luck with my new style starter. Plus every time I hear somebody start a high compression performance motor, they have that distinct cranking sound you get from a permanent magnet gear reduction starter.

In the other camps, Mopars have always used gear reduction starters, before permanent magnet technology and now with it. Rarely do Mopars have a cranking issue. Older GM's like Ford, used non gear reduction starters and it was common for them to have the same cranking issues when hot.

Best Regards,
Mike

[gordo428scj]

Thanks for the help mike.

[Sandman5000]

I have had similar hard start situations due to heat and installed starter heat shield blanket which did not help and the real issue ended up being a starter solenoid that was not completing the circuit. Just another thought, and you might want to swap it before or with a new starter any way.

[1969_Mach1]

Thanks for the help mike.

No problem. If you get around to replacing it, for added insurance it might be wise also add a piece of insulating sleeve material over the battery cable if it is near the exhaust manifold.

It is possible your starter relay is has too much resistance and bad like Sandman5000 mentioned. I hope I didn't overlook something. but those are far away from engine heat and not many go bad so it slipped my mind. It might be worth trying. That's an easy part to replace. To truly diagnose the problem component, when the engine is hot and the issue is present, voltage drops across both the positive and negative circuits should be measured. This will isolate which component is the problem.

Best Regards,
Mike

[1969_Mach1]

I was only trying to solve your issue with the turn of a wrench instead of a $250.00 starter. However, that may be what you'll end up doing if you can't successfully play with the timing. FE's are pretty forgiving though if your cam is installed "straight-up" and not advanced 4 degrees (like most guys install them) IF you have indexed sprockets.

Yeah, retarding the ignition timing will often help cranking. I apologize and didn't mean to disrespect the idea and disregard your post. If I have an inclination of the cause of an issue and cures for it, I like to offer that information. Then let the owner decide the approach they want to pursue.

Best Regards,
Mike

[Mach1FatherFigure]

You could also try heat lagging the headers. Depending on what extras your car has I don't see the need for an alternator with more than 80-100 amps - unless you have a 1,000w sound system for instance!
Heat lagging cheaper than a new starter and also has a marginal positive performance effect.